{"id":5376,"date":"2022-01-05T08:35:33","date_gmt":"2022-01-05T07:35:33","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/?p=5376"},"modified":"2023-03-12T10:24:36","modified_gmt":"2023-03-12T09:24:36","slug":"debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/","title":{"rendered":"D\u00e9bats ou invectives au conseil municipal"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<p>La Gazette a d\u00e9j\u00e0 publi\u00e9 <a href=\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/04\/faire-de-la-place-a-charles-de-gaulle\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">un article <\/a>sur le conseil municipal du 16 d\u00e9cembre, qui aborde notamment le dossier de l\u2019am\u00e9nagement de la place Charles de Gaulle. Il s\u2019agit ici de revenir, non pas sur le fond, mais sur la mani\u00e8re dont s\u2019effectuent les \u00e9changes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>La s\u00e9ance du 16 d\u00e9cembre avait plut\u00f4t bien commenc\u00e9. Le stationnement payant et la d\u00e9l\u00e9gation de service public aff\u00e9rente \u00e9taient \u00e0 l\u2019ordre du jour. Dans une intervention solidement argument\u00e9e, Fabrice Bernard \u00e9voquait le d\u00e9veloppement rapide des voitures \u00e9lectriques et des v\u00e9los \u00e0 assistance \u00e9lectrique et s\u2019interrogeait sur les cons\u00e9quences \u00e0 en tirer dans les parkings publics. Dans sa r\u00e9ponse, Patrice Patt\u00e9e, adjoint \u00e0 l\u2019espace public et aux mobilit\u00e9s affirmait plusieurs fois \u00eatre d\u2019accord avec le conseiller d\u2019opposition sur les points \u00e9voqu\u00e9s.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Attaques personnelles<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>Et puis on est pass\u00e9 au sujet suivant, avec les \u00e9volutions du projet de la place Charles de Gaulle. Les avis ont \u00e9t\u00e9 moins consensuels, ce qui n\u2019a en soi rien d\u2019anormal&nbsp;: si des membres du conseil municipal ont \u00e9t\u00e9 \u00e9lus sur des listes concurrentes, c\u2019est bien qu\u2019ils avaient des d\u00e9saccords sur un certain nombre de sujets&nbsp;!<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Pour autant, les d\u00e9saccords justifient-ils les attaques <a href=\"https:\/\/fr.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Argumentum_ad_hominem\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">ad hominem<\/a>, voire <a href=\"https:\/\/fr.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Argumentum_ad_personam\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">ad personam<\/a>, telle que celles que l\u2019on a pu entendre \u00e0 l\u2019occasion de ce sujet&nbsp;? J\u2019ose penser que non. Rappelons que ce type de propos consiste \u00e0 s\u2019attaquer aux personnes plut\u00f4t qu\u2019\u00e0 leurs arguments. Il donne le sentiment \u00e0 l\u2019observateur ext\u00e9rieur que les personnes qui les utilisent manquent d\u2019arguments sur le fond. Souvent il traduit le fait que les \u00e9motions ont pris le pas sur la raison pour ceux qui les tiennent. &nbsp;Une des choses qui m\u2019a frapp\u00e9 en arrivant \u00e0 Sceaux, c\u2019est la politesse au quotidien de pratiquement tout le monde. Doit -on faire exception quand la politique s\u2019en m\u00eale&nbsp;?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>A la Gazette, on cherche \u00e0 s\u2019int\u00e9resser \u00e0 ce qui se passe au Conseil Municipal. C\u2019est ainsi que j\u2019ai pu assister \u00e0 une partie des trois derni\u00e8res s\u00e9ances. Et j\u2019ai constat\u00e9 \u00e0 chaque fois des attaques que je consid\u00e8re comme \u00e0 la fois inutiles et d\u00e9shonorant les personnes qui les portent. Pr\u00e9cisons tout de suite qu\u2019il y en a eu peu, on pourrait m\u00eame dire tr\u00e8s peu, mais ce peu est de trop. Pr\u00e9cisons aussi qu\u2019il est volontaire de ne pas les nommer ici, le but n\u2019est pas de stigmatiser tel ou tel mais de proposer de changer. Ces attaques sont venues de plusieurs camps, ce n\u2019est pas une question de position politique. Peut-\u00eatre faut il sugg\u00e9rer aux personnes qui se laissent ainsi emporter de faire une formation \u00e0 la <a rel=\"noreferrer noopener\" href=\"https:\/\/fr.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Communication_non_violente\" target=\"_blank\">communication non-violente<\/a>&nbsp;?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Je pr\u00e9cise que je compte dans ces attaques ad hominem celles qui consiste \u00e0 d\u00e9nier \u00e0 certains le droit de parler d\u2019un sujet pour une raison li\u00e9e \u00e0 sa personne. Et je dois dire pour finir que j\u2019ai vu la plupart des membres du conseil se comporter dignement.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Quel d\u00e9bat possible&nbsp;?<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>La loi du 19 novembre 1982 a donn\u00e9 aux listes minoritaires <a href=\"https:\/\/fr.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/%C3%89lections_municipales_en_France#Les_scrutins\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">une place<\/a> dans les conseils municipaux des villes de plus de 3500 habitants, place qu\u2019elles n\u2019avaient pas auparavant. En 1999, le S\u00e9nat a d\u00e9battu d\u2019une <a href=\"https:\/\/www.senat.fr\/leg\/ppl99-128.html\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noreferrer noopener\">proposition de loi<\/a>, \u00e9manant d\u2019\u00e9lus socialistes, tendant \u00e0 \u00e9tendre ce syst\u00e8me aux villes de 2500 \u00e0 3500 habitants. On peut lire dans l\u2019expos\u00e9 des motifs&nbsp;:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><em>La loi n\u00b0 82-974 du 19 novembre 1982 a institu\u00e9 un mode de scrutin mixte combinant scrutin majoritaire et repr\u00e9sentation proportionnelle dans les communes de 3 500 habitants. Ce syst\u00e8me fonctionne bien et personne aujourd&rsquo;hui ne songe \u00e0 le remettre en cause. Il permet \u00e0 la fois \u00e0 la majorit\u00e9 de gouverner, \u00e0 la minorit\u00e9 de s&rsquo;exprimer et de participer \u00e0 la gestion des affaires.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Ce syst\u00e8me a probablement un avantage&nbsp;: une \u00e9quipe gagnant les \u00e9lections apr\u00e8s avoir \u00e9t\u00e9 dans l\u2019opposition a normalement une connaissance des dossiers qui lui permet de d\u00e9marrer son mandat dans de bonnes conditions. Dire que la minorit\u00e9 participe \u00e0 la gestion des affaires parait cependant un peu pr\u00e9somptueux. On peut cependant esp\u00e9rer qu\u2019il y a des d\u00e9bats utiles en commission et que les suggestions des minoritaires y sont \u00e9cout\u00e9es, voire parfois entendues.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Mais les s\u00e9ances du conseil municipal ne peuvent gu\u00e8re avoir se r\u00f4le. On y vote des textes d\u00e9j\u00e0 ficel\u00e9s. Bien s\u00fbr, majorit\u00e9 et minorit\u00e9 y \u00e9changent des explications et des arguments qui peuvent \u00e9clairer le citoyen qui s\u2019interroge sur les actions de la municipalit\u00e9. L\u2019action des minoritaires est cependant extr\u00eamement limit\u00e9e par les r\u00e8gles en vigueur, le l\u00e9gislateur ayant eu la sagesse de laisser \u00e0 la majorit\u00e9 les moyens de gouverner (majorit\u00e9 confortable assur\u00e9e par la prime au gagnant, maitrise de l\u2019ordre du jour et maitrise des d\u00e9bats).<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>En s\u00e9ance, cela donne 90% des \u00e9lus de la majorit\u00e9 dont le seul r\u00f4le est de voter \u00e0 la fin de chaque discussion (enfin voter, il leur suffit de ne pas r\u00e9agir quand le maire&nbsp;demande qui vote contre puis qui s\u2019abstient). Des conseillers d\u2019opposition qui tentent d\u2019apporter la contradiction et qui se pr\u00e9parent longuement en ce sens. Un maire qui consid\u00e8re que l\u2019unanimit\u00e9 prouve qu\u2019il a raison et g\u00e8re bien et que des votes contre prouvent que l\u2019opposition n\u2019est pas s\u00e9rieuse.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Lors du dernier conseil, un \u00e9lu a not\u00e9 qu\u2019il n\u2019y avait que trois p\u00e9kins dans les rangs du public. Deux des trois \u00e9taient des r\u00e9dacteurs de la Gazette (qui n\u2019y ont pas vu une attaque personnelle). La r\u00e9alit\u00e9 est que le citoyen a ses propres responsabilit\u00e9s, familiales et professionnelles, et qu\u2019il n\u2019a gu\u00e8re envie de passer du temps \u00e0 assister \u00e0 ce qui ressemble \u00e0 une pi\u00e8ce o\u00f9 tout est d\u00e9j\u00e0 \u00e9crit.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>La Gazette a d\u00e9j\u00e0 publi\u00e9 un article sur le conseil municipal du 16 d\u00e9cembre, qui aborde notamment le dossier de l\u2019am\u00e9nagement de la place Charles de Gaulle. Il s\u2019agit ici de revenir, non pas sur le fond, mais sur la mani\u00e8re dont s\u2019effectuent les \u00e9changes. La s\u00e9ance du 16 d\u00e9cembre&#8230;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":11,"featured_media":5423,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"om_disable_all_campaigns":false,"_monsterinsights_skip_tracking":false,"_monsterinsights_sitenote_active":false,"_monsterinsights_sitenote_note":"","_monsterinsights_sitenote_category":0,"_uf_show_specific_survey":0,"_uf_disable_surveys":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[53,5,266],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-5376","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-analyses","category-des-quartiers-de-sceaux","category-sceaux","entry","simple"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v25.6 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>D\u00e9bats ou invectives au conseil municipal - La Gazette<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"fr_FR\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"D\u00e9bats ou invectives au conseil municipal - La Gazette\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"La Gazette a d\u00e9j\u00e0 publi\u00e9 un article sur le conseil municipal du 16 d\u00e9cembre, qui aborde notamment le dossier de l\u2019am\u00e9nagement de la place Charles de Gaulle. Il s\u2019agit ici de revenir, non pas sur le fond, mais sur la mani\u00e8re dont s\u2019effectuent les \u00e9changes. La s\u00e9ance du 16 d\u00e9cembre&#8230;\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"La Gazette\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2022-01-05T07:35:33+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2023-03-12T09:24:36+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/01\/640px-2013-01-30_19-19-31-oser-le-debat.jpg\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"640\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"316\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/jpeg\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"G\u00e9rard Bardier\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"\u00c9crit par\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"G\u00e9rard Bardier\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Dur\u00e9e de lecture estim\u00e9e\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"5 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"Article\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/#article\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/\"},\"author\":{\"name\":\"G\u00e9rard Bardier\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/#\/schema\/person\/5650e206a121f68c6f5e76379bccfbc4\"},\"headline\":\"D\u00e9bats ou invectives au conseil municipal\",\"datePublished\":\"2022-01-05T07:35:33+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2023-03-12T09:24:36+00:00\",\"mainEntityOfPage\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/\"},\"wordCount\":1024,\"commentCount\":10,\"publisher\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/#organization\"},\"image\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/#primaryimage\"},\"thumbnailUrl\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/01\/640px-2013-01-30_19-19-31-oser-le-debat.jpg\",\"articleSection\":[\"Analyses\",\"Quartiers\",\"Sceaux\"],\"inLanguage\":\"fr-FR\",\"potentialAction\":[{\"@type\":\"CommentAction\",\"name\":\"Comment\",\"target\":[\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/#respond\"]}]},{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/sceaux-lagazette.fr\/index.php\/2022\/01\/05\/debats-ou-invectives-au-conseil-municipal\/\",\"name\":\"D\u00e9bats ou invectives au conseil municipal - 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